Switching from Test to Design Engineering at Boeing

After graduating with a bachelor's degree in mechanical enginering, Joey held 3 jobs at 3  companies, in 3 years. Refusing to get "stuck" as a Test Engineer, he successfully pivots into Design Engineering roles at Boeing and Blue Origin.

Disclaimer: Opinions expressed are solely my guest's and my own. They do not express the views or opinions of our employers.

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Transcript

00:01.47

sharonpak5

Hi guys welcome back to another episode of tech exploited today I have my good friend Joey Doe who is currently working as a fluid systems engineer at blue origin with me. Um, he got his bachelor's degree at cal state fullerton where we both majored in mechanical engineering. And now we are both living in Washington together. But this guy unlike me actually goes to the gym frequently. He's freaking jacked. Um, he works out in his crocs which is absolutely ridiculous in my opinion. Um, but his motto is that.

00:24.72

joey

F. What an introduction. Thank you so much and that's it's true. Yeah, once you lift a certain amount of weight. No one should question you. But yeah, we'll see I'll give you have an update on that later. But.

00:52.88

sharonpak5

Um.

00:57.41

sharonpak5

Okay, okay so I Joey I I let's jump right in. So let's talk about your background you were at Boeing and Backo beforehand and then do you want to talk a little about about how you ended up a blue origin why you ended up at blue origin from boeing.

01:11.18

joey

Oh that's that's quite a cheicy story. Yeah, so I started off at Vacco I got super lucky so I graduated in 2020 you know during the pandemic and woo. Let's let's go you know I was interning at vaco at the time and I was able to talk with the director.

01:23.10

sharonpak5

Whoo.

01:30.89

joey

Think around April may coming up on graduation I was nervous. You know are they going to give me a full-time offer I didn't know but all I did was walk into his office and ask them hey I've been working with this one like advanced products group super interested in what they're doing and just for just so that you guys know it's like. All small sad keeps app propulsion systems I was like whoa. This is the coolest shit I've ever gotten to work on and.

01:52.30

sharonpak5

Could you explain a little bit more What a cube sat is like I know what it is. You know it is because we're both in the space industry by fuck a lot of people don't know what Cube set is.

02:02.47

joey

Sure um I don't remember the exact categorization because I've never worked on the actual sal itself. But it's just the actual physical size and envelope of a satellite so Keepsats and I don't remember the size but it's just a very small satellite.

02:07.47

sharonpak5

Earth. Is.

02:19.28

joey

That would be placed in a rocket and launched into space for any specific mission. Oh yeah, so I walk into the director's office and simply asked them like hey really loved working with these guys you know would it be possible or for me to have an offer when I graduate from college and.

02:21.56

sharonpak5

The.

02:38.61

joey

He said you know what? you've been doing some good work and because I wasn't on that team when I was interning I would spend extra time after work or on the weekends to support them and you know I impresseded them and they gave me an offer afterwards and then right when I graduated I immediately started so starting from there.

02:42.24

sharonpak5

Who.

02:55.30

sharonpak5

Wow.

02:58.32

joey

A lot of the work was mostly working in a clean arm environment where you're fully dressed up in a bunny suit running tests evaluating different types of failures just all saw the hands on work that any mechanical engineer would want. You would get so awesome experience. There. And after about a year and a half of working there. The management was just there was too much change going on to where I feel like my future with that company would not be where I'd want and that's when I started a job like hunting and then ended up landing a design role at Boeing.

03:36.50

sharonpak5

Um, and that's like big aerospace for the first time right? because back is like a distributor you guys make more like peace parts. Um. And then you guys give like subsystems to like the bigger aerospace companies right? Yeah I think it's really interesting too in your story. How you said that you just walked into the director's office and asked for a job. So if you didn't do that they want to have hired you or.

03:48.99

joey

That's correct. That's correct.

03:58.40

joey

They would not they. They've always had listings for higher levels but they purposely created like an associate level title just for me they said apply to this specific one I didn't even need to do an interview I started immediately.

04:09.88

sharonpak5

Um, a wow.

04:13.81

sharonpak5

Wow.

04:15.57

joey

After asking so it was one of those very lucky moments where I I was just very glad that I just stepped up and asked.

04:23.33

sharonpak5

Well, that's actually incredible because I feel like most people wouldn't do that like just go into a director's office and be like hey man I'm graduating can I have a job right? like that takes some balls if you will like.

04:35.90

joey

Yeah, for yeah back then I was definitely very nervous doing that. But thank God The company was really small and the director's office was in the same area as all the other cubicle so you can just walk in anytime you wanted one of those.

04:49.66

sharonpak5

Did you know him beforehand or was this like the first time you ever interacted with him. Okay.

04:56.88

joey

I've known him Beforehand got to interact with him a few times because a lot of the information that I would get from the cleaning room regarding certain failures would be relayed back to him sometimes I would be the messenger for that.

05:10.40

sharonpak5

Okay, and so you went from backco to Boeing which is obviously a huge aerospace company. Huge ah they make the planes. Yeah as a design engineer so you could talk a little bit about what you're doing.

05:17.19

joey

They make the pines.

05:25.20

sharonpak5

Um, at your role as a design engineer at Boeing.

05:26.95

joey

Sure yeah working at Boeing was not what I thought it was going to be. You know when I first joined I was very naive at the time I assumed. Okay, big company, big responsibilities but it was the other way around as a design engineer I found myself being told a lot.

05:40.67

sharonpak5

Ah.

05:45.96

joey

What to do which you know as a low level person isn't that big of a deal but they don't give me any overview of the reasons why we're making these changes I don't get to see the actual engineer behind it I felt like what we would consider Cad Monkeys essentially where

05:58.58

sharonpak5

Her her.

06:05.83

joey

They say make this part with this dimension and that's that you go and do it, you make your drawings with that and you send it over and so I find myself not doing a lot of actual critical thinking while working at Boeing so I got to work on some aircraft parts.

06:10.30

sharonpak5

Ah.

06:17.18

sharonpak5

Her her.

06:23.44

joey

And actually one of the projects is the transsonic truss braced wing that Boeing just recently announcedd where where they partnered with Nasa to create a very efficient plane flying at I believe mock point 7 speed. You can you can find that. Online but I worked on that project for a little bit I got to support boeing and El Sugudo and then same with another team in Everett and all 3 roles were very similar in the sense that.

06:47.10

sharonpak5

Okay.

06:53.10

sharonpak5

Her.

06:58.47

joey

You felt like just a very small person in like a giant like world Any of design roles. You don't really get much of a say in it and that stopped.

07:02.95

sharonpak5

He. So You weren't doing the actual engineering part. It's just kind of like you're doing like the dirty work for someone else. It felt like like the stuff that people didn't want to do. It's like here like make this drawing and here all the dimensions don't ask why just do it.

07:15.82

joey

Absolutely.

07:22.40

joey

The only time where I felt like I had a say was when I was working with the Everett team. This was with safety analysis so we worked on these documents called Ssa's and these were system safety analyses and.

07:25.64

sharonpak5

Okay.

07:31.67

sharonpak5

The.

07:39.81

joey

We have to work on these documents now because of all of the crashes that were happening all around the world with the boing seven thirty seven s so with that the Faa has really like increased the amount of analysis that we have to do so that's where I could actually physically go look at models and see how would they break.

07:43.33

sharonpak5

Yeah.

07:59.57

joey

And label how critical these failures were so I actually would have conversations with my boss about categorizing these things and it was very engaging compared to all of the other things that I've worked on.

08:00.90

sharonpak5

Ah, her.

08:10.80

sharonpak5

So what is like a day in the life of a design engineer like what are your typical roles and responsibilities at Boeing because I feel like design a lot of times people see as a very like sexy job right? or it's like oh you get to working Cad get to work with the different like aircraft wings right? It's like everyone and. School initially like even myself included I wanted to be a design engineer at 1 point in my career and I feel like a lot of people who major in mechanical engineering. That's like the pinnacle right? They all want to become a design engineer and especially at big companies like boeing so as a design engineer like before you figured out what the job it actually was.

08:40.62

joey

Are.

08:48.93

sharonpak5

And you realized that you wanted to have more ownership of the products that you are working on I'm sure at first when you got the roll, you're like oh snap like I made it I am a design engineer for Boeing right? So like can you like walk us through what that kind of look likeo what your day to-day responsibilities were.

09:03.87

joey

Yeah I Think for my case I was very lucky that my boss interested me with some of the harder projects. So I got to work out of the Huntington R and D team. So with that I was constantly working with a mentor and.

09:11.48

sharonpak5

Are.

09:22.95

joey

Converting a lot of old Aircraft drawings that were you know, actually drawn on one of the large like like drafting tables. Yeah, these are hand writtent and they're they're like they're to scale so I had to create actual Cad models out of that I don't remember exactly what.

09:28.58

sharonpak5

Like handwritten right? yeah.

09:42.62

joey

Ah, we were trying to do afterwards because it got to a point where the project just could not progress further and then I got pulled out of it so there was that when I was working with Elsa Gundo on the design team I was working on a lot of tooling ground support equipment specifically these could range from.

09:50.49

sharonpak5

Ah.

09:56.93

sharonpak5

Her.

10:01.91

joey

Shipping containers or any type of tooling that will be holding a giant satellite with that I could be sitting in telecons for big chunk of the day with you know, ten fifteen people um yeah that's typical for boeing sitting in these large meetings is very.

10:08.29

sharonpak5

Ah.

10:16.51

sharonpak5

Ah.

10:21.77

joey

Common So just updates on where parts are and just any little updates and usually most engineers won't even contribute to the to these at all. So I would find myself simply drafting working in Drawings and.

10:38.44

sharonpak5

Ah.

10:40.33

joey

Yeah I I Yeah there there was not very much to it So there was that and then working on like the system safety assessment documents as well. Just constantly making small updates so I felt like I had a lot of free reigned. It wasn't very structured for me specifically.

10:42.78

sharonpak5

Okay.

10:50.45

sharonpak5

Ah.

10:58.74

joey

But I think some of my other teammates had much more structured. Um day-to-days like they were actually working with teams up in Everett and Renton and you know just based on the presentations that they presented to like our actual long beach team.

11:10.23

sharonpak5

Ah, here.

11:16.70

joey

Saw that a lot of them the work would really come down to like fasteners so much emphasis on that which I guess in in a sense makes sense. You know these are lower level engineers and they just have to make these small little replacements. But.

11:24.32

sharonpak5

Ah.

11:31.16

joey

Ah work just did not seem very interesting to me at all.

11:33.27

sharonpak5

Because you would think at Boeing you'd be working on the plane and you're like I want to design like the body of a plane or like a helicopter or something I don't want to be working on like nuts and bolts and fasteners right? like okay.

11:43.66

joey

Yeah, yeah, that that was my that was a big. It was very eye-opening to say at least that that's what a lot of my teammates worked on to where I questioned what made these engineers level Twos and level three s when.

11:50.88

sharonpak5

Her.

12:02.27

joey

These were the projects that they were assigned on. Maybe it just happened to be what was assigned to them at the time but not necessarily the extent of their capabilities. But I just expected more so when I watched the higher level of presentations and the projects didn't really get that much more complex.

12:05.56

sharonpak5

Are.

12:19.86

joey

Maybe really question how much I would be learning at this company.

12:22.67

sharonpak5

Okay, and so you went in with really high hopes of what you would be doing as a design engineer at Boeing and that once you started working on design engineer you're like I'm converting like hand drawn things. And to 3 d models and I'm working on designing fasteners like is this? Okay, okay, and so and that would you say that like half of your day were just meetings or like how many meetings would you have.

12:46.62

joey

Yep.

12:55.29

joey

You like 2 to 3 meetings a day. It just. Ah if you're on enough projects. Yeah you you'll be in a lot of tag ups. Yeah.

13:01.97

sharonpak5

Ok, and so that was your life at boeing and though what brought you to blue.

13:09.45

joey

So this is where the story gets a little spicy I yeah um so with the doors design center team that I was working with they wanted to fly me out up to everin to meet the team I've been working with this team for at least eight months now

13:10.76

sharonpak5

Yeah.

13:26.53

joey

They've really enjoyed my work and the whole point of me flying up was one a networking opportunity for me to connect person more personally with that team but also just to strengthen the relationship between that team and our actual long beach team. So I fly up get to meet the team.

13:42.29

sharonpak5

Ah.

13:45.70

joey

And I find out that 2 of my good friends from college Sharon and Yusef who both are working for blue right now happen to be in Seattle and so you know we we go grab some dinner together and we're catching up and we're we're talking about how you know I just joined Boeing and you know they just recently joined blue. Sharing our experiences as I'm listening to them I'm just thinking wow their work sounds so much more interesting. It's very very engaging. They were like the work really reminds me more of that like I was part of formula Essay. So a lot of like handson work. And much larger scope of ownership and yeah I just feel like I was not applying my brain I have not like when I was wearing a bone I don't feel like I really critically thought about like a lot of things for the whole duration. So you know they you know Sharon told me about the great.

14:25.77

sharonpak5

Ah.

14:38.39

sharonpak5

Ah, ah.

14:41.20

joey

Benefits where you you don't necessarily need to work the full day you know you can have an appointment for an hour or 2 but you wouldn't necessarily need to make up those 2 hours like hearing like the type of that level of flexibility that modern or culture but combined with. Traditional legacy aerospace like systems was seeming to be the perfect place to be so you know after talking with them about it I applied in December flora a fluid systems position started interviewing in January and they're they're very quick to respond back.

15:01.69

sharonpak5

Are ah a.

15:11.40

sharonpak5

A.

15:16.40

sharonpak5

The her.

15:18.47

joey

Very respectful people. They don't make you wait and within the span of 2 weeks I believe I already got to the final interview so went through with that final interview with the help of Sharon. And it was a great experience. It really felt like they were trying to understand the projects that you presented to them not really trying to question every bit of your knowledge. Why didn't you do this or why didn't you do that but more like it felt more like a conversation with them and that made it such? a.

15:39.89

sharonpak5

A.

15:52.15

sharonpak5

Are ah.

15:53.65

joey

Made such a great impression because I felt comfortable for that full hour whereas inside I was you know very nervous coming into it but really got to relax after so so in short and Sharon almost stole me she stole. Ah she stole me from boeing.

16:04.63

sharonpak5

Um, and I I.

16:09.82

sharonpak5

I mean you were in formula What you of right? and so I know did I steal you or the use of steal you or did just blue steal your heart I don't know you know I know but.

16:12.34

joey

Yeah.

16:22.12

joey

A little mix of everything I think but.

16:27.91

sharonpak5

Ah, what I will say is I think that also at like blue because like blue isn't necessarily a legacy aerospace company. It's more like a startup of aerospace and so now that you're at like this kind of or that's how I see it anyways because everything is like Brand new right? Like. Bone's been around since forever and Blue is like a much newer company and we're doing a lot of things that are like very different and so going from um, boeing which is a legacy aerospace company where you're a design engineer and now you're a fluid systems engineer but you're still in the design role. Um.

16:49.68

joey

Yeah.

17:06.38

sharonpak5

At Blue like are your responsibilities the same are they different is your scope of work kind of the same has it expanded like how's that look like for you.

17:14.80

joey

Yeah, that's a great question. So yes I am even though I'm considered a fluid systems engineer I am still technically a designer. You're right? and the difference is that here at Blue you're handed a small system or.

17:26.19

sharonpak5

Ah.

17:32.90

joey

Just any component and for the most part there are some like so design changes that can still be made to optimize so for me specifically I'm working on cryogenic helium bottles. So I own the whole bottle itself. So. It's like a 3 part or. About 5 pieces actually and you know usually if I were at boeing I would simply just make drawings for this you know working with a stress person. They would do most of the actual analyst work. Whatever numbers that they give me is probably what I would have put in in a drawing. But.

18:06.11

sharonpak5

Ah.

18:08.19

sharonpak5

Are.

18:10.34

joey

Here at blue every design engineer works as what we call an ah re or responsible engineer where you essentially own every single scope of this project. So currently I'm in design so I'm responsible for the actual 3 d model itself.

18:23.38

sharonpak5

Ah.

18:30.27

joey

Drawings the weld qualification because this actual part will be welded so I have to work with a weld engineer work with our vendor keep track of what they're doing making sure that we're on track to actually qualifying this part and then.

18:44.67

sharonpak5

Ah, her.

18:46.46

joey

Doing the actual stress and analysis myself for the past few weeks which has been great and very fun to learn because I didn't like how it boeing were. We didn't get that visibility over it. So now that I can see what assumptions you know analysts will make it's great for me in that sense. So.

18:53.40

sharonpak5

A ah her.

19:04.42

sharonpak5

Um, yeah.

19:05.83

joey

And additional responsibilities that I haven't taken on yet but will come to me in the near future. Is you know, flying out to the site in which these parts will be made so for us that'll be in Florida fly out to Florida getting to see the actual machines that'll make this part working with the technician to manufacture and then weld.

19:16.77

sharonpak5

Um, ah.

19:25.72

joey

And then test that's in the future but we get to do everything and that keeps job so interesting.

19:34.24

sharonpak5

Um, because you get to like work hands on you still get to do the design and the modeling you do the analysis. It's Like. Just kind of like when you're back in school when you're in formula and you got to like build the car and have a ah stake in the entire build and the design right? It's like very similar.

19:49.83

joey

I Think something that I've really appreciated here is that I get to do my own work and then present that to senior level people and yes it it is intimidating but I think there is after getting validated by them. The things that I did.

20:01.10

sharonpak5

Her.

20:08.67

sharonpak5

A.

20:09.53

joey

Right? things that did wrong. It kind of helps you build your confidence in in your skill set is like okay I know exactly what I'm doing right and wrong. So that you know exactly what to do the next time around whereas you but you would never develop that if you don't really put yourself out there.

20:19.13

sharonpak5

Are ah.

20:27.75

sharonpak5

Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely where there's just like a lot of opportunity for visibility right? for like people to see the work that you're doing that are really high up and that's kind of cool. Um because I'm sure that at Boeing there's a lot more like glares of separation in between you guys. So you probably never talk to senior people or presented to them.

20:29.32

joey

That sounds.

20:37.43

joey

A house.

20:47.44

sharonpak5

It was probably like your managers and wear that doing it for you even though you worked on that product. Yeah, okay and so you've been at a lot of different companies within the last three is years barely right? since we graduated. Um.

20:50.60

joey

Exactly.

21:00.58

joey

Are.

21:04.48

sharonpak5

How's that been for you like that journey of graduating and then transitioning into your first Java vacco and then like jumping twice. Um, after that so like 3 years through companies almost.

21:16.16

joey

Yeah, it's been very eye-opening I initially thought that I would be rabbit holeed into a specific type of role because of what my experience says about you know about me and because I was doing a lot of testing.

21:33.23

sharonpak5

Um.

21:36.13

joey

I didn't want to get rapidt hold into that and I was almost going to be if I stayed Atd vacco and I knew I wanted some design experience so I hopped into boeing but that wasn't necessarily the the design skills that I wanted so I felt it's necessary for me to hop again. But what I've learned from.

21:38.98

sharonpak5

Ah.

21:47.10

sharonpak5

Ah.

21:51.54

sharonpak5

Ah.

21:56.22

joey

Hopping around to is that I have the confidence and the skill set to be like pretty multidisciplinary in a sense where just because I'm only doing testing in 1 spot doesn't mean that these skills aren't transferable in another role and it's.

22:14.51

sharonpak5

Ah, the.

22:16.10

joey

Honestly, it's been great because I've gone to see different types of roles and now I know what it's like to do those different roles and taking the chance is very important early on so that you know in the future. What trajectory you want for your career path.

22:21.44

sharonpak5

Her.

22:32.57

sharonpak5

Okay, and so when you said that you didn't want to get rabbit hold into like testing or design. Um is there A reason why you didn't want to get rabbit hold into like testing or design and is it because you didn't like being a test engineer Or. Um, what was kind of like your rationale behind that.

22:47.63

joey

Being a test engineer is actually very fun being on the floor pressing the button yourself. Oh I mean it's it's scary, but but when things work out. There's no better feeling than just calling that program manager saying we passed right. The the only issue was that I found myself staying and working extremely long hours Ten twelve hours on our acceptance testing and I found that I was not treating my my own self like my own body very well because of that just the.

23:07.60

sharonpak5

Ah.

23:11.27

sharonpak5

Her.

23:25.67

joey

Pressure that I felt to execute things. So I'm still open to being a test engineer and maybe that was more of a boundary thing that I didn't set for between myself and work at the time but initially I thought oh my God What if I only had these hands on skills.

23:27.70

sharonpak5

A hat.

23:34.13

sharonpak5

Sure.

23:44.13

joey

Um, you know, does that mean in the future if I wanted a design role I would automatically not be eligible for that right? So that's where I felt like I needed to take the leap and even if it meant taking a small little pay bum but just to start from level 0 and.

23:53.46

sharonpak5

Ah, ah.

24:03.20

sharonpak5

Ah.

24:03.51

joey

Build that design skill which is what I did and I'm very happy that I went with that.

24:07.34

sharonpak5

Okay, and so when you transition from testing engineer to design engineer. How did you kind of like sell yourself to boeing because I'm sure that they were asking questions right? They were like why don't you want to do testing again. Why do you want to design.

24:22.18

joey

Yeah, and it was for that exact reason of I got to see it I got to work with a lot of hardware I've got to troubleshoot all of it but I actually wanted to do some design myself daca wouldn't give me the opportunity of well.

24:31.77

sharonpak5

Um, ah.

24:39.36

sharonpak5

Ah.

24:42.10

joey

Here are the things that we think are wrong with this system. You know, can you shave down more weight. Can you optimize this design more. They didn't give me the opportunity so I wanted to use all the things that I've learned from test engineering at the same type of.

24:48.33

sharonpak5

A Earth earth.

25:00.42

joey

Problem solving skills but Indesign. Yeah and and the questions that Boeing asked for an l one position at least were very simple I think what boeing really looks for for lower level positions is your behavioral.

25:04.55

sharonpak5

Um, okay gotcha. Um.

25:19.12

joey

Just how you act around the team. Are you a team player your technical skills is not as big of a deal they do ask you about it but not to the depth that bluewood.

25:19.18

sharonpak5

Um.

25:34.97

sharonpak5

Sure, Yeah, um, boo's interviews a little longer and a little more rigorous, right? Just slightly. Ah, okay, and so now that you've been back was a pretty small company boeing and blue are lot bigger.

25:38.50

joey

Absolutely absolutely.

25:51.61

sharonpak5

Um, and having been at both like startup aerospace and being at Legacy aerospace and being at like smaller, not necessarily mom and pop but like kind of ish that vibe right? Um, what are some of.

26:04.26

joey

Um, ah.

26:05.95

sharonpak5

Differences that you saw there and what are some of like the pros and cons you think you'd like pull from each 1

26:13.54

joey

With vacco because it's a smaller company about 500 employees what I liked was how easily I could get things done if I really wanted to get it done meaning if a technician decided to call out and we still need to get to run a test.

26:23.21

sharonpak5

And.

26:32.48

joey

Would go and run it myself if I needed to get a part machined I can just walk into the machine shop and get it done. Um, so because everything was within walking distance I could hustle and really get my work done that way.

26:39.14

sharonpak5

Ah, ah.

26:48.22

sharonpak5

Ah.

26:49.49

joey

Cons However, is that it's not very Organized. We don't have a lot of systems and processes in place that I felt like worked well for us I don't remember any specific. Examples at the moment. But yeah, then going to boeing at least it was the other way around where there was way too much red tape. There was too much isolation between the different business units.

27:08.82

sharonpak5

Um, okay.

27:25.26

joey

And.

27:34.69

joey

Do you need to cut this part real quick I.

27:38.60

sharonpak5

A pause.

27:43.64

joey

Ah so yeah, working at Boeing it felt like it was very difficult to make any meaningful impact all the work that you did felt like you worked on very tiny assemblies that you could not even recognize on.

27:52.82

sharonpak5

Ah.

28:01.26

joey

Any aircraft to be honest, but maybe I was also way too new at the same time to be able to see what this specific tiny part in this giant system was and because there are just so many employees that all have their very niche like roles I feel like you do 1 thing and then you're.

28:17.46

sharonpak5

Ah.

28:20.55

joey

If if that checks out and that that part that you've worked on moves on to the next level you are immediately moved to something else and so what I was lacking up. You don't move with a part for my team at least yeah because the long beach team.

28:29.41

sharonpak5

Oh you don't move with the part. Oh okay.

28:39.59

joey

Functioned as you can think of us as a set of contractors that different sit like different. Um, let's call business units of Boeing would actually reach out to us saying we need x amount of design engineers for this one project.

28:56.88

sharonpak5

So you're very siloed so you guys have like no clue what's going on. They'd be like we just need support here so bring in the long beach crew. You guys come in you guys work on this little like.

28:58.68

joey

And we'll be pulled in just to do a specific task then we'll be pulled out.

29:11.58

sharonpak5

Part and then you guys are done and they're like okay we don't need you anymore like go back to wherever you guys came from. Okay.

29:15.97

joey

That's exactly how that worked in long beach so there could be a dry season or a very you know what brainy season and when I joined there were so many projects going on which is great but the downside is too is that there will be ah a drought that comes with that and huge layoffs too.

29:30.54

sharonpak5

Well.

29:33.91

joey

So I didn't like the fact that I never really got to invest my time into seeing a part or a larger system go from 1 point to another and yeah, coming from formula and vacco. That's that's what build.

29:43.10

sharonpak5

Okay, that makes sense.

29:52.53

joey

Ah, connection between me and what I worked on and now that I'm in blue and I own a whole part. You know way more than I did in Vacco it's it's different. It's it's a huge company. It's a very important component.

29:55.77

sharonpak5

Gotcha.

30:02.53

sharonpak5

That is a huge company.

30:12.23

joey

And I just feel present at work in the sense that like I feel super engaged with every aspect. Although there's a lot because you're the one or I guess and this is I'm the one talking with so many different people that are working with me on this project.

30:19.46

sharonpak5

Are.

30:29.87

sharonpak5

I have.

30:31.84

joey

Feels like a little community and it reminds me of what it was like to work in formula working with other sub teams there with you and everyone there is trying to get things moving and they have that same urgency that you do. They're not going to let things sit. So even if it means.

30:37.13

sharonpak5

Ah.

30:49.27

sharonpak5

Ah.

30:51.70

joey

Calling up other managers and asking why things aren't going through especially when it comes to the financing site or you know buyers that can't send out drawings on Tom we will go over give them calls or talk with their manager just to get things through so I do really appreciate the hustle that blue has and it feels like.

30:56.42

sharonpak5

Ah.

31:11.60

joey

Everyone on my team at least is just extremely supportive of each other even though we may not be working on the same part even though they're completely different systems but because we're still in the same fluids team meaning working on the same huge system we still take time out of our day to help.

31:16.79

sharonpak5

Ah.

32:09.55

joey

Yeah, exactly like it's it's kind of funny a lot of what we do are welding with tubes right? Which is what you just said right now. Um Benny Straw a lot a lot of brackets for me. It's a large titanium bottle.

32:19.55

sharonpak5

Bend Knee straws you're working with Bendy straws.

32:27.46

joey

That holds fluid and is submerged in fluid. So Holds Helium is submerged in Liquid hydrogen and because it's interacting with the fluid they're called Fluid systems.

32:41.84

sharonpak5

And okay.

32:46.52

joey

Typical Fluids role where you would think CFD or computational fluid dynamics. It's mostly structural.

32:55.68

sharonpak5

So computational fluid dynamics is normally when you have a computer system and then you're analyzing flow like laminar flow or whatever I guess the part right to see if it's like aerodynamic or um for gas efficiency for like a car. It's like oh like the Prius looks ugly because.

33:05.98

joey

Um, yeah.

33:13.25

sharonpak5

It's like super dynamic right stuff like that. Not that you drive a Prius or anything but you know like.

33:14.36

joey

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a really nice. It's a really nice color too. It's white. So yeah, no.

33:26.39

sharonpak5

Yeah, um, no comment there anyways. So ok, ok so when you said that you work with fluid systems. It's like literally it's because it's like a gas and even though that might not make sense for some people gas flows. And because it flows we call it like fluid because it's like fluidly flowing through like space. Yeah, because when you do your analysis. It's like very similar to if it was like a liquid being flown this really confused me in engineering school for the first I remember like when I was an engineering student I'm like air counts as a fluid.

33:46.49

joey

Yeah, that's still considered a fluid in this case.

34:03.99

sharonpak5

Like why you know like and then I learned that like yeah Cfd is a thing and air water or not just water any actual fluid that you analyze it very similarly so you staff drag.

34:12.91

joey

Yeah, and actually yeah and actually hopping into this job I thought I would be doing more of what you just mentioned because I came from Background. It came from a fluids background Calculating. Thrust. Calculating pressure loss Flow rates. These are things that I just genuinely really enjoy but coming to yeah and yeah, yeah, thermal dynamics like I Just love all of that and so coming here.

34:36.94

sharonpak5

You enjoy those things. How interesting couldn't be me but ok.

34:50.50

sharonpak5

Huh.

34:51.15

joey

Initially thought I would be getting to touch more of that. So I haven't It's more structural but it's also structural is something that I haven't gone to touch before where I get to evaluate like margins of safety stresses in in the bottle.

35:06.64

sharonpak5

Ah, yeah.

35:08.24

joey

So it's a new experience and I've learned a lot from that.

35:13.21

sharonpak5

So you wanted to do like the Cfd stuff you wanted to do thermoniament thermal dynamics. Um, and so you're working more on the structural like mechanical side. But if you wanted to do the other side of stuff would you be able to.

35:27.73

joey

If I wanted to I would be able to put my mind to it and learn again. Currently the structural things I don't know how to do but the fluid side of things I would be able to.

35:32.14

sharonpak5

Also you don't know how to do it right now.

35:41.14

sharonpak5

But you just don't work on it because you don't want to work on it or like how does that work.

35:46.40

joey

It's just the components that we're working on. Don't require that type of work right now that's not the problem statement. Yeah, a lot of the initial sizing for the for all the piping has been done already. So there's no need for me to do it.

35:51.38

sharonpak5

I Got you got acha. Okay, okay.

36:04.21

joey

For me I'm worried more about like thicknesses routing that sort of thing.

36:11.30

sharonpak5

Gotcha just because I was like I just said the app blue like anything and everything I've ever wanted to do at the company like everyone's always so open. They're like yeah sure like if you want to do that. Go do it. You know, like no one's stopping you like I'll connect you with their manager I'll connect you with the lead like that's what you want to work on.

36:20.72

joey

Um, yeah. I have people on my team that have only been working here for two months and are not two months about like four months and they they're being given an opportunity to transfer teams already from whatever they are working on to a completely different.

37:07.60

sharonpak5

Okay.

37:12.12

joey

Business unit. So I think that that that just presents great opportunities just wherever the help is needed most you want to contribute. They'll put you there.

37:13.21

sharonpak5

Um, yeah.

37:21.42

sharonpak5

Yeah, and I think it's really cool too because there's like such a big passion for mission at our company and like everyone's super like everyone's a space nerd right? So say everyone loves what they're working on. It's crazy.

37:31.13

joey

Absolutely absolutely you you come in. Not really thinking too much about it and then once you get to know your coworkers and Sharon told me this like how their passion for the topic made her passionate which was very cool.

37:49.75

sharonpak5

I Thought it was cool beforehand but I wasn't like Wow you know like Star Trek Star Wars like I'm still I don't I don't care about Star Trek and Star Wars still but like but like I know so much about what's going on in like space news because of my coworkers and I like genuinely find it like fascinating like I will stay up.

37:50.49

joey

Here? Yeah, ah.

38:09.42

sharonpak5

Late watching launches like I watched Sls launch and I was like texting my manager even though he lives in Florida right? And we're like texting that oh did you watch it like yeah and I was so cool and I like I never in 1000000 years thought that this would be me but like here I am yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

38:24.27

joey

Yeah, absolutely.

38:28.39

sharonpak5

Um, ok, and so now that you've gone to all these different companies. Obviously you love blue welcome to Disneyland um, what do you wish you would have done in college. Um. To better prepare for your role now or maybe even like a different role. Um do what would you have done differently.

38:55.25

joey

That's a very good question so in college although I was part of formula se I did not utilize it to my full capabilities and it's actually starting to show now not in a bad way. But it just means I have to compensate for some of that learning now. Um, so when I was in formula I put a lot of time into doing vehicle modeling. So I did a lot of coding on a program called Matlab that's where I was comfortable where I wasn't comfortable was working in the machine shop.

39:22.49

sharonpak5

Are.

39:30.97

joey

Working in the shop where everybody was welding just using a lot of different hand tools I was scared to do that and now in my career where I have the opportunity to make design changes change out interfaces or different joints.

39:39.13

sharonpak5

Ah.

39:49.94

joey

You know those were the things that I just didn't really pay much attention to in college and now I have to compensate by just you know, asking a lot of questions like very basic questions about fasteners or Welds or just like talking with people that are.

39:54.43

sharonpak5

Ah.

40:08.92

joey

Specialize in it because I just don't have the knowledge whereas you know if I actually worked in the machine shop or use utilize my hands a little more in college that wouldn't be the case.

40:16.61

sharonpak5

Um, you said that you were scared in Collagen So that's why I thought Mat lab was scary So I'm like what what do you say.

40:24.22

joey

Are.

40:30.10

sharonpak5

Scared like what were you scared of I guess like was it just a tools themselves was it the people around you or like what what was that all about.

40:36.13

joey

It was a little mix up everything I didn't grow up really getting to use power tools at all or any large form of machinery so seeing them operate and hearing about the horror stories made me really reluctant I was also very anxious in college. So I think.

40:46.27

sharonpak5

Ah.

40:54.75

joey

The act like the act of performing those activities made me scared to begin with but now having a crowd of people that are working there with me just created an environment where I just was not comfortable at all and you know over time I was able to slowly get.

40:55.55

sharonpak5

Ah.

40:59.90

sharonpak5

Are.

41:14.46

joey

Get more comfortable and actually work with Composites slowly working with my hands but it would not get to a point where I owned any part that I actually made with my hands that I could say like be proud of.

41:28.11

sharonpak5

Um I know for me in school I was just scared of like looking stupid and being wrong, right? Especially like when you said like crowd of people or I'm like you just assume that everyone else around you knows what they're doing right? and you're like. I Don't want to be that idiot that actually like screws it up and then like makes a fool out of myself in front of all my peers I don't know if that was like also a reason why? Um, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, and so now that you're working on mechanical systems like.

41:46.79

joey

Um, fifth.

41:51.49

joey

Absolutely absolutely.

42:01.55

sharonpak5

How did you get over that fear.

42:03.84

joey

It was the fact that people around me don't have the answers to any of my questions either and it was that on top of slowly building up my confidence over the years working at Vacco Vacco was a huge stepping stone for me because that's where I got to set up. Like test fixtures for our actual components run the test myself in so many different ways I got to pressurize the system do all the leakage checks run it through you know, thermal vacuums getting to touch a whole variety of equipment. You know that could potentially blow the whole thing up and it ever blew up.

42:28.53

sharonpak5

Ah.

42:43.46

joey

Thank God Um that that really helped me build my confidence just going. You know what? this is something that anyone can do you just need to slowly inch your way and dip your toes in it over and over again.

42:56.42

sharonpak5

Gotcha and so if you're to go back to school now. It sounds like you would have wanted to just put yourself out there and instead of being so scared just like actually pick up the power tools try and do the work right? It's kind of.

43:09.45

joey

Um, yeah, absolutely.

43:12.37

sharonpak5

Your biggest regret is okay gotcha but it also sounds like you're in an environment now where they're very supportive and they're like we don't have the answers but like maybe you could be the the dummy trial idiot right? and like see like but if it doesn't work out.

43:25.21

joey

Left.

43:28.10

sharonpak5

So a workout but we can't really give you flak for it either because we also don't know how it works is that kind of like the vibe or like.

43:34.65

joey

It it kind of is so I've spoken with a lot of l ones not just on my team different like I've spoken with Yousef I've spoken to you and just take at a general consensus of how everyone feels about their job and every ah re at a lower level has always told me yeah. I'm not really ready for this but this was the task given to me and there's no way I'm not going to perform and I have that same mindset right now too where okay it looks like a lot of people here. Don't really have that experience but they were given that great opportunity.

44:01.80

sharonpak5

Are ah.

44:10.56

joey

Yeah, we have all this money that blue has and to invest in all these crazy machines I'm going to go out and learn because my manager is so supportive of me. He's flexible with me and makes my work environment such a safe place for me I'm willing to go that extra step.

44:16.37

sharonpak5

Ah, ah.

44:27.61

sharonpak5

Um, her her.

44:30.25

joey

For him. So you know if they're willing to fly me out to Florida so that I can work with the guys are gonna build our parts. Yeah, it would be a little nerve raking. You know, having to actually be there for it. I don't know anything but damn like it seems like a lot of people don't either. But they'll find a way as long as I stay curious and I stay humble and I'm willing to learn I've realized that at the end everything will work out.

44:55.46

sharonpak5

Um, yeah, yeah, definitely and I think that's a like powerful too because I think that when you're in school. You think that once you graduate and start working in industry. You're going. You're gonna be fine, but then you realize you really don't know anything like at all, you know a little bit but like not that much not as much as you thought you would know. Once you graduate because when you look at all these like professionals right? that are actually working industry like wow, they're so smart they know everything and it's like no bro I don't know anything um and for me actually for the first three months that I was at blue I had the craziest imposter syndrome. Um. My team has the craziest backgrounds like some of them graduated from like Yale other ones graduated from like mit perdue. All really great engineering schools and I'm like what's up calsey bulletin right? And then they worked for all these crazy companies like they're Ex Nasa like they were on the shuttle programs. Um, they were like like skunk works right? So it's like the top secret lockheed programs the ones that make the aircraft for the military that like no one knows what they do. Um and I felt like super intimidated I was just like I know nothing.

46:16.22

sharonpak5

Why am I here? How do I even get here you know was I a diversity hire like I'm an asian female engineering like was I a diversity I don't know these are things that I have like turned my mind right? and for the first three months like I wanted to quit my job almost every single day.

46:28.58

joey

Ah.

46:35.80

sharonpak5

Um, just because the imposter syndrome was like crazy but like he said like my manager made it it such like a warm and like safe feeling environment. Even my team like my team is freaking awesome and they're like you're doing great and I'm like I don't know anything. Ah, but now like I love my job. Um, no more imposter syndr. Well, that's not true of there's probably like 1 or two percent so imposter syndrome. But it's night not nearly as bad where I'm like I felt like I didn't deserve to be there if that makes sense. Um whereas I just felt like so unworthy.

47:07.80

joey

Um, only if you compared on like based on accolades right.

47:11.29

sharonpak5

To be yeah and I was just like I don't know how I got here even like this kid that they just hired out of college I feel like a smarter than me like um, he was in the rocketry club in school I was and he knows more about how rockets work than I do. You know I just felt like super inadequate by I think that over a time. Um, just because my team created such like a warm. They never made me feel judged for the questions that I asked they were always like very um, kind and very patient with me. And even if I didn't understand things I've I had to like ask them to reexplain it because I didn't understand and I was like genuinely trying to understand like how these different systems worked I felt like that was like huge in making me feel comfortable and getting like situated and acclimated. Um, within like the first three months and now I'm fine and I'm being able to like run with my program and make tangible changes and whatnot I guess did you feel like you went through any of that at both like Boeing and blue or did you were you just like a superstar you're like let's go I can't perform.

48:12.30

joey

Yeah.

48:25.23

sharonpak5

Like imposter syndromes behind me. Don't have to worry about this anymore.

48:29.64

joey

Yeah, um, slightly different experience from you I don't think I've ever had that level of imposter syndrome like I knew that you know cal safe Forwardton not known for their engineering program. But for me I always evaluated based on.

48:35.14

sharonpak5

Just.

48:45.26

joey

And the conversations that it have with people. Um, so I'd never look at what school they came from they came from. It's more of how do you solve problems. So from Vacco because I was able to accomplish a lot I did feel really good about my capabilities and then hopping onto boeing seeing the.

48:46.70

sharonpak5

Her.

48:56.96

sharonpak5

Yeah.

49:04.52

joey

I Guess slightly lower level of work than what I'm used to did in a way inflate my ego a little bit or I went when I spoke with people it seemed like they didn't really have much of that same experience in the design field that they did but not actually working with hardware So when it got to about wanting.

49:12.34

sharonpak5

Ah.

49:16.55

sharonpak5

Her her.

49:24.30

joey

And a half years into boeing I felt like I wasn't really growing much anymore I feel like I was getting bored wasn't learning and I could feel that you know my friends that are working in Spacex in blue they're they're doing crazy things at the same age as me like.

49:26.74

sharonpak5

And.

49:43.21

joey

I want to make that level of contribution if I'm going to spend 8 hours a day somewhere I might as well be doing something that is really cool and that I'm and I could be potentially passionate about and coming to blue gave me that. Yeah.

49:51.66

sharonpak5

Sure sure sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, little did you know that your friends that blue down deep down inside were like I don't belong here. Everyone.

50:03.91

joey

Seriously.

50:07.83

sharonpak5

Ah, smart like I am stupid.

50:12.52

joey

Yeah, which which is an interesting thing because I feel like blue you're right? They do hire a lot of people that do not even come from the aerospace industry and I think it's a great wave you you? ah.

50:23.23

sharonpak5

Yeah I did come from the aerospace industry and I still felt stupid.

50:31.19

joey

Yeah I like that they usually just go objectively based on your skill set and the way that you solve problems and I think it's great to just be able to have different types of minds. You know in your workplace as opposed to just people.

50:47.70

sharonpak5

Sure sure for sure this on heard mentality that don't exist here. Ah okay, and so um, going back to like your experience from college. What do you think.

50:50.50

joey

Purely from aerospace. So.

50:54.85

joey

But now it does.

51:05.23

sharonpak5

Did in college to help you the most prepare for your career. Would you say it's like Essaye um, or I don't know how it's like I don't know essay's reputation is at other schools but I can say full 10 essay you was seen as like you're joining this club that's going to kill you.

51:20.15

joey

Absolutely.

51:22.17

sharonpak5

You're going to live there. You're goingnna die there you're gonna you're gonna sleep overnight in the room you're gonna probably sit in your car and you're just going to live on campus for the rest of your life hi.

51:30.14

joey

You you're pretty close to the truth on that one for our team specifically for Twenty Twenty all nineteen of us had at least a year or 2 under our belt working in ae already.

51:35.10

sharonpak5

Yeah.

51:45.58

joey

So what that meant was a lot of us were able to take on a lot of responsibility so preparing for like preliminary design reviews critical design reviews for all of our parts or designs in my case, a lot of high-level analysis on our vehicle like integrating every subsystem.

52:01.36

sharonpak5

Um, yeah, yeah.

52:05.23

joey

Felt like because I was doing something that was new and different. Um predicting vehicle performance with powertrain arrow and suspension and then doing like tire analysis. It gave me confidence in my ability to do work and.

52:12.56

sharonpak5

A.

52:21.92

joey

To stand by and like really understand what I was doing and present to a group of people. This is why I think we should go with these tires and this is why I think this is the performance we'll have just to build that confidence and it was extremely important when it came to presenting that information for interviews.

52:33.90

sharonpak5

Ah.

52:41.11

joey

In the future because I did use formula for blue's interview.

52:41.88

sharonpak5

Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, and so because he dedicated so much time to formula as a um, did you think it was worth it looking Back. Would you do it Again. Or do you have done something else.

53:00.22

joey

I Absolutely would have done it again but I would not have spent the same amount of hours that I did I would definitely spend a little more time at least doing having like a bit of a social life.

53:11.65

sharonpak5

Ah, okay.

53:17.20

joey

It was very unhealthy the way that a lot of us lived during those 2 years

53:23.96

sharonpak5

That's so interesting that you say that because like I interviewed Irwin right? and Irwin was also um, now he's at ge just finished the Edison program and he was just on an ah previous episode and he said something very similar where his like great experience. But it was like unhealthy how much time we spent at school. Um, so it's like it's interesting.

53:41.73

joey

It yeah, it was because a lot of us had the same goals. So when we saw each other all working in a shop late at night we just had that camaraderie and wanted to you know work even harder to finish our projects. But.

54:00.44

sharonpak5

Um.

54:00.52

joey

Looking back now we really did not need that much time we could have spent a little more time sleeping maybe go out and just have some fun here and there we I feel like we did not spend enough time doing that.

54:12.00

sharonpak5

You guys didn't spend enough time going on having fun here and there.

54:18.24

joey

Yeah I feel like I didn't get to socialize very much in college if people outside of this small group. My 14 buddies and that was it yeah, ah.

54:24.52

sharonpak5

Your 14 buddies and that's it hear 14 friends. Ok, ok, ok, it's like a mini fraternity essay use the name of a fraternity and other in those campuses they're an actual fraternity.

54:35.24

joey

It was yeah and yeah.

54:43.60

sharonpak5

Um, so that being said, what would be like your word of advice for other students like for students that want to end up at the big companies like boeing or at blue once they graduate want to work in aerospace because your role is in automotive. Um. And school I know that a lot of people from California they don't want to work in automotive after they graduate because they don't want to move out to the midwest um I don't know if that was also your reason why or.

55:10.93

joey

I was never a card guy until I joined us see I I did not understand how cards worked until I joined that club.

55:13.90

sharonpak5

What. Okay, and then now that you know how cars worked you just didn't want to do.

55:22.86

joey

Yeah, it it still wasn't that cool to me. It was like okay, that's how a car works that's interesting, but it's not interesting enough or I don't think a car at the time it was where I could feel like I could learn the most.

55:32.86

sharonpak5

Then why you join us e.

55:40.89

joey

About engineer and gained those skills in general. Um, and that's where if I were to give advice. It's really just learn as many skills as you can and just be curious I think being curious and just wanting to understand how things work.

55:44.56

sharonpak5

Ah.

55:53.71

sharonpak5

Ah.

55:59.22

joey

Won't get you anywhere.

56:02.62

sharonpak5

Um, what skills do you think were the most valuable that you learned from school that you brought into your career.

56:11.54

joey

I wouldn't even say it's like the technical skills like modeling coding or working with your hands like those things are important. But I think it's just your mindset and your willingness to learn. Is what has made me successful in every role for any job because essentially I went in not knowing how to do anything right? How how did any of my coding skills like how would any of that transfer over to me running testing on a propulsion system.

56:28.55

sharonpak5

Ah.

56:34.68

sharonpak5

Ah.

56:39.90

sharonpak5

Ah.

56:46.71

sharonpak5

Are.

56:48.18

joey

None of it was to be honest, but having that mindset of how do I solve this problem. Oh I think that's very interesting and being able to work with the team on that is what makes them want you.

57:05.47

sharonpak5

Yeah I think there's a lot of good points to that. Um I just interviewed a candidate today and that was what I was really prying for where I'm like how do you solve problems. How do you react when there's conflict and what would you have done differently. Um, those are 3 things that I ask all the time because you'd be very surprised at what comes out of or what their answers are right? or it's like there when when you ask them to walk them through a problem they faced. If they can't come up with one I'm like you weren't really a part of the team because every team has problems I'm like you were not integrated enough in the team for you to say that you don't have any problems that's capro right.

57:43.23

joey

Um, yeah.

57:48.45

joey

Yeah, absolutely and.

57:51.23

sharonpak5

And then I'm like okay when it comes to like people problems like how do you overreact right? when because you're you're bound to have people problems on your team. Not necessarily like you guys hate each other but you guys are going to disagree on something right on a design on an analysis. What you guys should be using for tooling what materials, etc. And so.

57:56.86

joey

Absolutely yeah.

58:06.82

joey

Yeah.

58:10.50

sharonpak5

Um I think like the people skills are also really important because when we hire people It's almost like we're hiring them into a family I think a lot of us see our co-workers more than we see our friends and family which is kind of sad but also kind of true. So yeah, yeah.

58:26.20

joey

Very true.

58:29.29

sharonpak5

You want to make sure that you're hiring someone. Um, that will meshwell your team and that you want to actually work with in Sierra on a day to day basis.

58:36.23

joey

Yeah, absolutely and I think it's also important to realize how much both you and I emphasized how great our teams are meaning that whenever we have issues and we're like oh can't figure this out and you just look to the person next to you and you ask them.

58:45.67

sharonpak5

Ever.

58:53.98

joey

And they're willing to walk over immediately and not give you an eye roll won't sigh immediately help you and you guys just get things moving and you know if you have everybody like that on your team. You can just get things moving right? So easily? yeah.

58:54.63

sharonpak5

Yeah.

59:01.93

sharonpak5

So true. That's why I love my team I bother my coworkers all the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I mean I even bothered use of today at work and we're not even on the same program right? I was like.

59:20.36

joey

Um, yeah.

59:20.50

sharonpak5

Hey do you have this thing. Do you know how to use it can you measure my part you know like help Well hey Yeah, yeah, yeah, so that's awesome.

59:25.82

joey

That's true. That's true that is true. Yeah, and I mean like I've messaged sharon to you know on teams asking about some manufacturing parts before because we don't have a manufacturing person and the fact you know that she's willing to to help me spend like 30 minutes sitting a meeting with me.

59:34.37

sharonpak5

Yeah.

59:42.85

joey

But she doesn't need to exactly. Ah.

59:43.59

sharonpak5

Explaining to you how our systems work I'm like you click here then you do this.

59:51.92

sharonpak5

Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and I mean like I think we've all been there right? where it's like if you don't know and when you're constantly at the grace of other people because our scope is like so big right? and we have so much ownership and when you're. When other people receive your questions graciously it just like makes you want to do the same for others where it's like oh like because other people were so nice to me when I didn't know how to use it. It's like I want to also do the same for someone else because I know that it made them feel safe and that it made them feel like. They could ask whatever they want and make them feel comfortable or at least that's how I feel or I'm like oh I'm so grateful for my team because they're so awesome and so I want to help be awesome and like help propel that culture more within the company.

01:00:28.28

joey

Absolutely.

01:00:35.60

joey

Yeah, like we we both know that people don't get paid over time here. So you know every minute that someone spends helping you right? It's just them not contributing to their project and I'm sure you know you've had the same experience where someone will walk off.

01:00:47.14

sharonpak5

Yeah.

01:00:53.61

joey

Whatever they're doing and sit down with you for an hour explaining some very like complex topics and teaching you in a way that like you can understand. It's just right? That's just free information and they're doing it just out of like the good of their heart.

01:01:02.68

sharonpak5

If if.

01:01:10.54

sharonpak5

But not always I've told you to sometimes or I'm just like Joey not right now hit me up tomorrow but not right now. Love you.

01:01:12.10

joey

And it just makes you appreciate people not always but happens often enough or for me at least? yeah, um.

01:01:23.87

joey

Yeah.

01:01:27.30

sharonpak5

But like sorry friend I am dying right now and this needs to get done now. So.

01:01:30.60

joey

Yeah, it's fair enough but you know at least most people are willing to tell you like hey can do right now. But here let's me at a time that'll work for the both of us and that's honestly, that's all you need. That's all you need.

01:01:40.14

sharonpak5

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely Okay, any last words for the the children in college.

01:01:51.94

joey

Half fun with it. Don't stress all you'll you all, you'll all be okay at the end put your mind to it.

01:01:54.12

sharonpak5

Have fun with it.

01:02:01.58

sharonpak5

Though you won just kidding I Yeah yeah, yeah, so good. Um, especially coming from like an Asian background right? where it's like pressure is high um life is.

01:02:02.54

joey

Ah, yeah, don't listen to please please don't listen. Ah.

01:02:15.21

joey

Um, yeah, yeah.

01:02:19.28

sharonpak5

Better after you graduate I Promise you have money and you can do fun things and you can spend the money and it's just so much better than when we're in school we sleep in our own apartments Now we don't sleep in our cars like.

01:02:29.76

joey

Um, yeah, did you damn that wait. You know what I did too I take that bag I I've definitely stuffed in the parking a lot before.

01:02:35.47

sharonpak5

I did yeah.

01:02:44.30

sharonpak5

I Mean that was assumed for you because you're in formula I just wanted to nap in peace in my car and I couldn't find parking so I couldn't leave so I just slept in my car.

01:02:48.50

joey

Yeah, whatever dude yeah, you're right? whatever.

01:03:00.19

joey

You know what that that was a real issue in school that was real. Ah.

01:03:01.34

sharonpak5

No parking Guess what that don't go away either. We still don't have parking out work. Okay, like yeah.

01:03:07.75

joey

Yeah, no parking but you guys have to come to the office you understand not up desk but kind of come to the office. Sure.

01:03:17.78

sharonpak5

We don't talk about that. But anyways, thank you so much Joey this was awesome. Um, and yeah I appreciate your time and I appreciate you talking about your experiences and how you've really.

01:03:28.76

joey

Um, thank you for having me on.

01:03:30.22

sharonpak5

Been able to progress in your career and it sounds like you landed in a great spot.

01:03:33.10

joey

Yeah, thanks for having me was great talking to you.

01:03:36.22

sharonpak5

Yeah, my pleasure meant it.